#mapnik log: Monday 22, February 2010

2010 | 02

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00:00:19 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: Ticket #332 (Rendering curved paths) updated | http://trac.mapnik.org/ticket/332#comment:12
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01:06:06 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: image_18b.svgz attached to Ticket #332 | http://trac.mapnik.org/attachment/ticket/332/image_18b.svgz
01:08:53 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: mapnik.mr.smooth.0.7.0.cairo.diff attached to Ticket #332 | http://trac.mapnik.org/attachment/ticket/332/mapnik.mr.smooth.0.7.0.cairo.diff
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01:29:43 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: Ticket #332 (Rendering curved paths) updated | http://trac.mapnik.org/ticket/332#comment:13
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08:36:00 <dodobas> yello
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12:19:30 <huats> springmeyer, ping me once yore are available
12:19:33 <huats> thanks !
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14:45:19 <Dominic032> hey guys
14:45:43 <Dominic032> someone out there who has experience on building mapnik on Red Hat Enterprise Linux5?
14:57:54 <Dominic032> nevermind, got it!
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16:11:56 <springmeyer> huats: I'm awake! :)
16:14:49 <huats> springmeyer, great !
16:14:52 <huats> lazy ;)
16:15:10 <springmeyer> :) I know I know!
16:15:20 <springmeyer> huats: put me to work! ;)
16:15:31 <huats> exactly !
16:15:50 <huats> springmeyer, I have noticed something doing the packaging (the gdal stuff is fixed)
16:16:36 <huats> in the 0.6 series, everyting was built in the usr/lib/ stuff while now there are in usr/lib and usr/lib64
16:16:40 <huats> is it normal ?
16:17:11 <springmeyer> that is an problem that has always needed to be patched
16:17:19 <springmeyer> in debian/ubuntu
16:17:46 <springmeyer> I don't think anything changed between releases
16:18:21 <springmeyer> but the patch likely does not apply cleanly anymore, so it was skipped?
16:18:32 <huats> actually I have removed it
16:18:34 <huats> I think
16:18:34 <huats> :)
16:18:43 <huats> because I think it was integrated
16:18:47 <huats> let me look at this :)
16:19:03 <springmeyer> #394
16:19:04 <nikq> Ticket #394: Don't install in lib64 on debian systems, http://trac.mapnik.org/ticket/394
16:19:13 <springmeyer> not yet fixed upstream
16:19:37 <springmeyer> only because I think it needs to stay defaulting to lib64 for fedora and like systems
16:19:48 <springmeyer> otherwise I would fix it now
16:20:53 <huats> http://pastebin.com/f1167cab8
16:21:03 <huats> that was the patch right ?
16:21:49 <springmeyer> yes, that looks fine
16:24:17 <springmeyer> now it would be (for 0.7.0) http://pastebin.com/m690ac756
16:24:49 <springmeyer> though I'm not sure if even ppc64 would use lib64 on debian...
16:27:33 <huats> ok
16:27:39 <huats> I have just removed it
16:27:46 <huats> then it might be the issue :)
16:27:50 <huats> I will update it
16:27:53 <huats> then
16:27:56 <springmeyer> great
16:27:59 <huats> ad let you know :)
16:28:08 <springmeyer> thx!
16:28:21 <huats> have you rolled out the 0.7.1 (I mean appart from a tag in svn ?)
16:29:01 <springmeyer> no, not yet
16:29:14 <springmeyer> I need to discuss with other developers
16:31:09 <huats> ok
16:31:29 <huats> do you have a rought idea of when it will be available
16:31:37 <springmeyer> I will let you know as soon as I do
16:31:52 <springmeyer> it just depends on what other items devs want to address
16:32:20 <springmeyer> so, earliest could be the end of this week, but we'll see
16:32:52 <huats> the thing is that we are already late for the inclusion, so I am asking you in order to know if I need to try to push the 0.7.0 and then to update it with the various patches or to wait for the 0.7.1, knowing that the more we wait, the less we have chances to get included
16:32:54 <huats> ok
16:33:04 <huats> please let me know
16:33:24 <huats> for the moment I am focussing on getting a good package for 0.7.0
16:33:37 <huats> once it'll be done we'll need to decide
16:33:39 <springmeyer> yes, I think we should push for 0.7.0
16:34:13 <springmeyer> and update with patches
16:34:31 <springmeyer> but 0.7.1 is a plan b
16:35:51 <huats> ok
16:35:59 <huats> I need to go for some shopping
16:36:07 <springmeyer> okay, enjoy, thanks again :)
16:36:15 <huats> I am building 0.7.0 with the patch during that
16:36:18 <huats> and I'll let you know
16:36:21 <springmeyer> great
16:36:24 <huats> no pb thanks to you
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16:42:24 <springmeyer> ah cool
16:42:37 <springmeyer> it looks simple, we can just check for debian systems
16:42:45 <springmeyer> via platfrom.dist()
16:42:47 <springmeyer> >>> import platform as p
16:42:47 <springmeyer> >>> p.dist()
16:42:47 <springmeyer> ('debian', 'lenny/sid', '')
16:42:52 <springmeyer> in python/scons
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16:46:32 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: Changeset [1640]: don't install by default in lib64 on debian systems - closes #394 | http://trac.mapnik.org/changeset/1640
16:49:56 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: Changeset [1641]: don't install by default in lib64 on debian systems - closes #394 | http://trac.mapnik.org/changeset/1641
16:50:57 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: Ticket #394 (Don't install in lib64 on debian systems) closed | http://trac.mapnik.org/ticket/394#comment:2
16:53:16 <springmeyer> huats: ^^ okay, __now__ its fixed upstream :)
16:53:20 <huats> :)
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17:52:13 <dodobas> yello
17:58:22 <springmeyer> hey dodobas
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18:22:47 <dodobas> springmeyer: today, i was thinking that i need something like 'pull out unique tags of interest'
18:22:55 <dodobas> you made my day, 15min ago :D
18:23:12 <springmeyer> ah, ha :)
18:23:30 <springmeyer> we should turn that into a little command line script to pass in a bbox too :)
18:24:03 <dodobas> :)
18:24:58 <springmeyer> the reason the osm plugin is so slow is that is parses all tags (I think), which is frankly, awesome
18:26:22 <dodobas> a good side effect :
18:26:24 <dodobas> :)
18:26:44 <springmeyer> :)
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18:54:43 <huats> springmeyer, for the record your patch for the changeset 1640 might not be correct
18:54:44 <nikq> http://trac.mapnik.org/changeset/1640, at , by dane: don't install by default in lib64 on debian systems - closes #394
18:55:03 <huats> since on ubuntu : >>> print platform.dist()
18:55:03 <huats> ('Ubuntu', '9.10', 'karmic')
18:55:19 <springmeyer> ugh
18:55:27 <springmeyer> worried about that
18:56:16 <huats> and also the other derivatives...
18:56:31 * springmeyer had read http://mail.python.org/pipermail/new-bugs-announce/2008-September/002823.html
18:56:37 <springmeyer> but did not know when it took affect
18:56:53 <springmeyer> hmm, need a more robust way then
18:57:53 <huats> well according to the sources : _supported_dists = (
18:57:53 <huats>     'SuSE', 'debian', 'fedora', 'redhat', 'centos',
18:57:53 <huats>     'mandrake', 'mandriva', 'rocks', 'slackware', 'yellowdog', 'gentoo',
18:57:53 <huats>     'UnitedLinux', 'turbolinux')
18:59:30 <springmeyer> hmm, "Ubuntu" not in that list?
18:59:49 <huats> indeed... I haven't noticed
19:00:10 <springmeyer> hrm, maybe it would be easier to detect systems that do actually use lib64...
19:00:23 <huats> springmeyer, it checks the lsb-release
19:00:31 <huats> whcih might be great...
19:00:43 <huats> so your method might be good :)
19:00:50 <huats> but add Ubuntu also :)
19:01:02 <springmeyer> right, that could work
19:01:31 <springmeyer> if platform.dist()[0] in ("Ubuntu","debian") ... then don't use lib64
19:02:06 <huats> yep
19:02:17 <springmeyer> will do that for now...
19:02:23 <huats> and if anything else is needed, won't be hard to add
19:04:26 <springmeyer> yes
19:04:34 <springmeyer> thanks huats - I'll fix up in a bit
19:04:38 * springmeyer takes call
19:04:49 <huats> sure
19:05:07 <huats> springmeyer, I am rebuilding on i386 right now to test in a lucid vm
19:05:23 <springmeyer> great, I've got a lucid VM ready too
19:05:51 <huats> hehe
19:06:00 <springmeyer> x86_64
19:06:20 <huats> I can send you my .deb if you want (for x86_64)
19:07:35 <huats> I have already built for x86_64
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19:46:59 <springmeyer> hey huats: sure :)
19:50:17 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: Changeset [1642]: check for both 'debian' and 'Ubuntu' to figure out lib schema | http://trac.mapnik.org/changeset/1642
19:53:44 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: Changeset [1643]: check for both 'debian' and 'Ubuntu' to figure out lib schema | http://trac.mapnik.org/changeset/1643
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20:38:29 <fucnqshun1> hello, i'm interested in how custom renderings of osm are done, e.g http://blog.oobrien.com/oom/
20:38:42 <fucnqshun1> can you tell me more?
20:42:08 <springmeyer> fucnqshun1: most osm renderings use XML styles
20:42:28 <springmeyer> some start with the "standard/official" ones and modify from there
20:42:41 <springmeyer> I'm not sure if ollie did that
20:42:56 <springmeyer> he very well may have started from scratch because his styles are much simplier
20:43:05 <springmeyer> e.g fewer colors, no text, etc
20:46:02 <fucnqshun1> springmeyer: ok, how to start with these styles?
20:46:39 <springmeyer> well, depends on how you like to learn
20:46:43 <fucnqshun1> also, how does the hosting for such custom styles work? is it queried from osm.org, or is it all hosted on ollie's site?
20:46:50 <springmeyer> I recommend starting really simple
20:47:13 <springmeyer> to learn how to hand author the XML parts so you know what things do
20:47:29 <springmeyer> so later on its easier to debug tricky rendering issues
20:48:16 <springmeyer> by simple I mean the first two tutorials at: http://trac.mapnik.org/wiki/MapnikTutorials
20:48:36 <springmeyer> hosting: lots of options
20:48:56 <fucnqshun1> springmeyer: pls tell me more about hosting? i dont want to pay for hosting
20:49:07 <springmeyer> generally the easiest thing to do first is to generate a set of tiles on the filesystem (locally)
20:49:31 <springmeyer> then use ftp/sftp/ssh to transfer them to a cheap storage-based web host
20:49:59 <fucnqshun1> i see
20:50:26 <springmeyer> you need to pay something, but storage can be cheap
20:50:50 <fucnqshun1> so sites such as opencyclemap etc are paying for their tiles?
20:51:39 <springmeyer> certainly
20:52:14 <springmeyer> although ocm I think has hosting donated
20:52:14 <fucnqshun1> springmeyer: what do you do with mapnik yourself?
20:52:48 <springmeyer> I'm a developer
20:54:22 <fucnqshun1> so what do you do?
20:55:25 <fucnqshun1> also, are you slavic
20:55:54 <huats> springmeyer, what is the usage for the rundemo test (the cpp one) please ?
20:55:58 <springmeyer> I'm american
20:56:18 <springmeyer> huats: hmm, I rarely use it, one sec
20:56:23 <huats> springmeyer, thanks :)
20:57:30 <springmeyer> hmm, the rundemo does not seem to be being built on my system (os x)
20:57:53 <huats> I had to build it
20:58:02 <huats> sorry I have a diaper urgency
20:58:02 <springmeyer> okay
20:58:09 * springmeyer understood!
20:58:18 <huats> I am back in a few minutes I hope...
20:58:22 <springmeyer> k
20:59:54 <springmeyer> oh, because I commented out the install, duh
21:00:56 <springmeyer> fucnqshun1: certainly many slavic mapnik users around
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21:03:24 <fucnqshun1> springmeyer: yes, the name is a clue
21:03:59 <springmeyer> yep, name is from germany
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21:07:14 <fucnqshun1> nah i mean 'mapnik'
21:08:34 <springmeyer> ah ah, surely
21:08:53 <springmeyer> yes, father of mapnik is russian
21:14:49 <cmarqu> Taking Mapnik, Kosmos/Maperitive, mapsurfer, Cascadenik, freemap.sk, Marcin's and dodobas' work etc. makes it seem that this area of the world is overly blessed with (online) map guys
21:15:07 <cmarqu> s/overly/more than average/ :)
21:15:59 <springmeyer> ya, its really astonishing
21:35:02 <fucnqshun1> cmarqu:  what did marcin and dodobas do?
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21:39:33 <springmeyer> fucnqshun1: #332
21:39:34 <nikq> Ticket #332: Rendering curved paths, http://trac.mapnik.org/ticket/332
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21:46:13 <springmeyer> huats: this works for me
21:46:28 <springmeyer> python scons/scons.py #without install will build rundemo
21:46:37 <springmeyer> cd demo/c++
21:46:45 <springmeyer> ./rundemo /usr/local/lib/mapnik/
21:47:33 <huats> it works too
21:47:35 <huats> here
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21:49:04 <springmeyer> great
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22:04:36 <springmeyer> anyone here compiled icu or boost from source on linux ?
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22:07:53 <Ldp__> springmeyer: if you count pulling from portage as 'from source', then yeah
22:08:05 <springmeyer> great
22:08:21 <Ldp__> emerge boost icu
22:08:22 <springmeyer> I just need a paste of $ ldd /path/to/libmapnik.so
22:08:23 <Ldp__> done ;)
22:09:05 <Ldp__> http://pastebin.com/d1d77f411
22:10:33 <springmeyer> ack :)
22:10:37 <springmeyer> so clean
22:10:45 <springmeyer> :)
22:10:58 <springmeyer> I was hoping for some different paths that /usr/lib :)
22:11:02 <Ldp__> what were you looking for?
22:11:11 <Ldp__> ah
22:11:22 <Ldp__> well... /lib is there
22:11:25 <springmeyer> pretty nice source/trunk compiles go into /usr/lib
22:11:30 <springmeyer> ah, nice
22:11:36 <Ldp__> libm
22:11:37 <springmeyer> that is good, missed that
22:11:40 <Ldp__> libgcc etc
22:11:55 <springmeyer> do you know what /lib "means"
22:12:17 <Ldp__> # ls -l / |grep lib
22:12:17 <Ldp__> lrwxrwxrwx   1 root root      5 Jan 24 23:27 lib -> lib64
22:12:17 <Ldp__> drwxr-xr-x   3 root root   4096 Jan 30 06:57 lib32
22:12:17 <Ldp__> drwxr-xr-x   8 root root   4096 Jan 30 06:57 lib64
22:13:20 <springmeyer> what does this give?
22:13:24 <springmeyer> ldd /lib/libz.so.1
22:13:36 <Ldp__>         linux-vdso.so.1 =>  (0x00007fff2dd6b000)
22:13:36 <Ldp__>         libc.so.6 => /lib/libc.so.6 (0x00007f3a7080a000)
22:13:41 <Ldp__>         /lib64/ld-linux-x86-64.so.2 (0x00007f3a70d91000)
22:14:24 <springmeyer> k, thx
22:14:40 <springmeyer> do you have an /include ?
22:14:47 <springmeyer> figure probably not...
22:14:54 <Ldp__> nope
22:15:14 <springmeyer> k
22:15:31 <Ldp__> http://pastebin.com/d498a29b1
22:16:22 <Ldp__> springmeyer: been meaning to ask... do you believe persist_connection in the postgis plugin still works as meant to?
22:16:46 <springmeyer> Ldp__: one more thing?
22:16:49 <springmeyer> ldd /usr/local/lib/mapnik/input/*input
22:17:02 <springmeyer> Ldp__: I think it works yes, what have you noticed?
22:17:30 <Ldp__> http://pastebin.com/d479cfebf
22:18:29 <Ldp__> I have a layer where I have a few million objects I do ST_Centroid on, and this causes postgis to use lots of memory
22:18:39 <Ldp__> which I don't see released, until I restart renderd
22:18:59 <Ldp__> could be a postgresql issue, or just plainly mapnik not dropping the connection
22:19:35 <Ldp__> but the server this ran on, went heavily into swap, as in 2-3GB swap used. Which was instantly freed whenever I restart renderd.
22:19:48 <Ldp__> even with persist_connection=false
22:20:47 <Ldp__> in the mean time I stopped doing ST_Centroid, as mapnik will happily do point placement for a polygon and is faster at it to boot
22:20:57 <springmeyer> hmm, seems like the connection is just the connection and should not be related to that much memory usage
22:21:11 <springmeyer> but thats just a guess, sounds concerning either way
22:21:24 <springmeyer> you should be able to rule out the connection issue
22:21:40 <springmeyer> its pretty easy to watch it get created and droped and see if that is happening
22:21:40 <Ldp__> be that as it may, being able to free 3GB swap and 2GB mem (postgresql based) just by restarting renderd, is peculiar
22:21:49 <springmeyer> yes, certainly
22:22:21 <springmeyer> unless it is postgres optimizing/caching somehow
22:22:24 <Ldp__> I've had a hard time getting pg to log on that machine, so I didn't check the connections from pg's end yet
22:22:28 <huats> springmeyer, https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/mapnik/+bug/526070
22:22:57 <huats> is the URL of the request I am filling to get the exception to get 0.7.0 in lucid
22:23:10 <huats> if you think you need to add some stuffs do not hesitate...
22:23:12 <Ldp__> but restarting renderd is certainly dropping any leftover connections to postgresql, which got me thinking about persist_connection=false not working
22:23:29 <Ldp__> weren't we going to try to get 0.7.1 in the distros?
22:23:33 <springmeyer> huats: !!!!
22:23:45 <springmeyer> hooray for huats !
22:24:11 <springmeyer> Ldp__: yes, I can see the "connection" I agree
22:24:31 <huats> Ldp__, yes, but 0.7.0 is almost a needed step
22:24:46 <huats> (since the deadline for new stuffs is already past)
22:24:52 <springmeyer> yep
22:25:05 <springmeyer> and I need to fix raster bugs before I feel okay about 0.7.1
22:25:05 <huats> (for a few days)
22:25:14 <Ldp__> huats: as soon as 0.7.1 is out, I want to be able to use the new features in osm.xml. FYI wrt distro based distribution of 0.7.0
22:25:32 <springmeyer> oh ya, that one too ;(
22:25:43 <Ldp__> specifically the dropping of type="png" from symbolizers
22:26:20 <Ldp__> but I guess I could keep those in for a bit longer. Not having to include width/height is a major win, already in 0.7.0
22:26:42 <springmeyer> huats: also, just for reference, 0.7.0 is essentially 0.6.2 in spirit, but we have to increment ABI because C++ is so touchy
22:27:01 <huats> ok I will change that
22:29:14 <huats> springmeyer, I have updated the description
22:29:43 <springmeyer> :) nice
22:29:54 <springmeyer> thanks for all your excellent efforts huats
22:30:17 <springmeyer> your email to debian-gis also kick off quite a great movement on debian side too
22:30:19 <springmeyer> thank you
22:32:02 <huats> oh really ?
22:32:08 <huats> I haven't noticed :(
22:32:24 <huats> I should check because I might not be subscribed
22:32:33 <huats> you have received email about it ?
22:33:53 <springmeyer> hundreds
22:34:37 <huats> springmeyer, hum there is someting here we might use. Since the debian package is already done. It might be great to wait for it to include it instead of my ubuntu package... It is something to investigate
22:35:15 <springmeyer> pretty much seems like the pkg-grass-devel@lists.alioth.debian.org list was cc'ed on each change David Paleino made in preparing pkg for debian
22:35:26 <huats> ok
22:35:27 <huats> :)
22:35:33 <springmeyer> huats: sure, what ever you think is best
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23:50:18 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: Changeset [1644]: scons: fix subtle bug in scons usage resulting in lost paths on mac os x | http://trac.mapnik.org/changeset/1644
23:51:39 <nikq> Mapnik Trac: Changeset [1645]: scons: fix subtle bug in scons usage resulting in lost paths on mac os x | http://trac.mapnik.org/changeset/1645
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